tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29059245.post8905175101003949792..comments2024-03-25T02:33:41.590-05:00Comments on FemaleScienceProfessor: FameFemale Science Professorhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/15288567883197987690noreply@blogger.comBlogger15125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29059245.post-71799214570539374782008-01-09T16:27:00.000-06:002008-01-09T16:27:00.000-06:00It is probably safe to assume that the number of p...It is probably safe to assume that the number of people who have read your papers or MSP's is significantly higher than the number of citations. Between papers for classwork, papers for work-work, and the occasional paper for fun, the number I have read is probably already in the hundreds, and I am fairly early in my career. Unfortunately, there is no way to account for this, other than possibly the reams of paper consumed. So at least add a few zeros after MSPs '4,' even though there is no way to easily quantify such things. <BR/><BR/>I have to say that the number of people who have read a paper is probably not an accurate way to measure overall fame. Your students (probably) know who you are, as do coworkers, colleagues, and advisors. In the ever-important scientific networking game, reading a paper is not a prerequisite to being well known. And if you look at nobel prizewinners who are famous in history and the media, the number of people who have actually read the original papers is probably very small compared to their noteriety. <BR/><BR/>Somewhere, somehow, Einstein has been on the side of a bus, and many people will recognize his name and face. Most of those same people will have only a vague idea of what e = mc^2 means, much cited his research. In this case Einstein has become a cultural icon and is famous for that, as much as his scientific acheivements. So you are probably both more famous than you give yourselves credit for, although probably still not in the impress-your-daughter kind of way.<BR/><BR/>I wonder if Einstein ever thought he would be on the side of a bus?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29059245.post-52424672330940093552008-01-09T16:08:00.000-06:002008-01-09T16:08:00.000-06:00i'm guessing you were in London at the Tate modern...i'm guessing you were in London at the Tate modern.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29059245.post-39263010918045316852008-01-09T06:13:00.000-06:002008-01-09T06:13:00.000-06:00We need to remind ourselves that a paper that is "...We need to remind ourselves that a paper that is "cited" is not necessarily a paper that is "read" :-)<BR/><BR/>See, for instance, http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn3168-scientists-exposed-as-sloppy-reporters.htmlAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29059245.post-3653253017646223452008-01-08T07:50:00.000-06:002008-01-08T07:50:00.000-06:00I'd like to follow up on my previous comment and M...I'd like to follow up on my previous comment and Ms. Ph.D.'s reply. I don't think I live in a bubble but do think I have a longer perspective than I did when I started out in this business almost thirty years ago. <BR/><BR/>When I began, fame wouldn't have entered my mind. I started because science was so fun, and I couldn't believe they paid me to do it. Going to my first scientific meeting (the "corn conference") and seeing that there were hundreds of folks who loved it like I did was amazing, and attending my first "fly meeting" was similar. Eventually I did get considerably more cynical and I do check my citation index, but I still maintain that viewed with a long lens science is a collective enterprise. <BR/><BR/>Work of which I was a part as a student is now in the developmental Biology textbooks, and I teach it to my undergraduate students, explaining to them that thirty years ago we had no idea how development was regulated at the molecular level, and no concept that the genes that regulated it were shared by all animals. That is one of the coolest discoveries of the last fifty years, and its fun to have been a part of it.<BR/><BR/>Mark P.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29059245.post-56774107145592563132008-01-07T22:52:00.000-06:002008-01-07T22:52:00.000-06:00My graduate advisor WAS on the side of a bus - a s...My graduate advisor WAS on the side of a bus - a shuttle bus of a certain national lab that she was associated with. It was a bizarre thing to see your boss on a bus going right by you...but I guess that would mean that it is possible for a scientist to be on-a-bus-kind of famous.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29059245.post-86690746773602577672008-01-07T22:30:00.000-06:002008-01-07T22:30:00.000-06:00who the hell wants to be famous?!now, where did yo...who the hell wants to be famous?!<BR/><BR/>now, where did you all go diving?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29059245.post-86660766346554345262008-01-07T19:42:00.000-06:002008-01-07T19:42:00.000-06:00Your blog is now the second result on that google ...Your blog is now the second result on that google search. <BR/><BR/>I also agree with winnie.EcoGeoFemmehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11236907917990309659noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29059245.post-52156617981565562542008-01-07T16:58:00.000-06:002008-01-07T16:58:00.000-06:00I wish I could've gone to a European city when I w...I wish I could've gone to a European city when I was young. Your daughter is lucky!revintraininghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15608592537353587921noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29059245.post-35934845613146087052008-01-07T16:34:00.000-06:002008-01-07T16:34:00.000-06:00Interesting. Kind of sad for me, since I identifie...Interesting. Kind of sad for me, since I identified most with MSP and your daughter in this scenario. <BR/><BR/>My name will never be on the side of a bus, and I continue to question that, as I have since I was a child. <BR/><BR/>I have always wondered if most people are born with this wish for acclaim, and if only a strange subset of us never really recover from the inevitable realization that we'll never have it? <BR/><BR/>Btw, I think Mark P is living in an idyllic bubble. Science might have been a collective enterprise once upon a time, but at least in my field, calling it that sounds absolutely ridiculous.Ms.PhDhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06542602867472447035noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29059245.post-38294371532343718442008-01-07T13:46:00.000-06:002008-01-07T13:46:00.000-06:00What about humility? What about teaching your chi...What about humility? What about teaching your child that being famous is not the be-all-end-all? What about teaching your child that there are many ways to be a successful and productive member of society - but one that will never be famous! Not everyone should be famous - and not everyone should strive to be famous! One should strive to be the best they can be, and presumably to also help others in whatever way they can do best. <BR/><BR/>And - one can do those things and help others, even without being famous.<BR/><BR/>(<I>please note</I> - this isn't meant as criticism ... just to explore an alternative view)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29059245.post-72856490873587420452008-01-07T12:28:00.000-06:002008-01-07T12:28:00.000-06:00Here is your measure of fame. Googling "the most b...Here is your measure of fame. Googling <BR/>"the most beautiful floor in the world" gives FSP as the third result.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29059245.post-7543838676687533272008-01-07T11:34:00.000-06:002008-01-07T11:34:00.000-06:00winnie, if you search on the phrase "the most beau...winnie, if you search on the phrase "the most beautiful floor in the world", you will probably figure it out..Female Science Professorhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15288567883197987690noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29059245.post-23351373408563449392008-01-07T10:42:00.000-06:002008-01-07T10:42:00.000-06:00We've had this question, too. My daughter asked wh...We've had this question, too. My daughter asked whether we knew anyone who was "famous". I deduce (but do not know) that the question was induced by having a classmate whose parent has won an Oscar. I tried to name some famous people (I don't think I qualify, but my husband, and others have a degree of fame within their particular ponds). She was also not impressed. Her goal was conventional fame (the bus would have been great, I think) . I think she's probably right. The people I know have success, but not fame.<BR/><BR/>Scientific fame seems to come through communicating, and not doing the science -- interesting, but I think not surprising. I recently stumbled on a book that purported to be about how people became scientists, but I ended up putting it down, because none of the folks fit my definition of scientist -- they were, instead, science writers.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29059245.post-64959404742656066162008-01-07T08:48:00.000-06:002008-01-07T08:48:00.000-06:00I'm with commenter one. This blog will get you mo...I'm with commenter one. This blog will get you more fame than any set of papers short the Nobel, and if your skills as a scientist even remotely match those as a blogger.... <BR/><BR/>The humor in the comment is much appreciated by those who have been in the busniess awhile, but the truth behind it is also worth considering. Kids can unveil the "man hidden behind the curtain" in profound ways and this is an excellent example. I was a bit sad to think about the fact that you are right about the number of folks who read even the best cited papers. Unless you become the very top person in your field, this is your "fate". <BR/><BR/>However, what is cool and you should tell your daughter is that science is a collective enterprise. Lots of bits and pieces from folks like you and I get put together into a truly beautiful picture. I teach both cell and developmental biology and cancer biology, and its striking to see how much we have learned in the last twenty years, when all our work is summed together. I am proud of the work my lab does and the insights we have added to the mosaic. <BR/><BR/>Mark PAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29059245.post-24487082109639197112008-01-07T08:07:00.000-06:002008-01-07T08:07:00.000-06:00I think you'd definetely win the "fame game" if yo...I think you'd definetely win the "fame game" if your blog weren't anonymous... I've been reading you for almost a year and you never knew it! I am really curious as to where you went on holidays, more clues please? ciao,Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com